I don't think the US removes 500k children from homes each year (but am open to being wrong about that) - maybe that's the total number of children in foster care?
Also, re: the state removing children from homes, I hope both participants in the conversation agree that is wrong whether it's for giving kids blockers/hormones (like in Texas) or for not giving kids blockers/hormones (like in Oregon and California).
This seems like an issue that would really benefit from lowering the temperature of conversation and not acting like the most marginal cases (both parents who want very young kids to transition and angry fundamentalists who disown their kids) are representative of the majority of trans people and their families.
Also, there is a disanalogy in the comparison in that Ukraine's population is a tenth of the United States' and Putin removed kids from there within a span of a few months. I agree with you about lowering the temperature.
I do not think that the guest from the ACLU helped by comparing the current moment in the US to Jim Crow, Nazi Germany, Putin's Russia, etc. One might even say she is trying to turn up the heat.
This article throws out all sorts of straw men and logical fallacies.
Trans people are not being demonized for being trans. TRANS PEOPLE ARE BEING DEMONIZED FOR RECRUITING LITTLE CHILDREN before sexuality should even be a discussion for children.
Additionally, the LGBT community make up a relatively small portion of society and the trans community make up a much smaller portion of society. Why are their rights being pushed to the forefront of the discussion while other much larger communities are being maligned?
This sort of partisan, short sighted, divisive journalism does more harm than good and literally greats a reason for the "right wing populism" you are opposing to grow.
Your comment clarified something for me. Namely, one of the key features of contemporary American right-wing thought is a perspective that says mere acknowledgment and recognition of ideas and identities social conservatives don't like is indoctrination (and so morally blameworthy), while actual indoctrination into ideas and identities they do like is instead mere acknowledgement and recognition (and so morally acceptable—and often morally praiseworthy and necessary).
What you describe is the MO of the Left just as much as it is of the Right. Both sides are open to bias, but the real root concern here is that the Left is OK to make mistakes and sweep them under the rug in regards to how children are treated.
For example, with the transgender movement they are OK to experiment on children even if it's damaging to MANY of them in the future. While the Rest of the World is waking up and stopping sex change operations on children, in North America they continue to push them harder than ever.
They used the same rationale with Covid-19 shots in the West. Unproven, experimental drug but they are being mandated / pushed into children...EVEN AS THE REST OF THE WORLD EITHER DE-RECOMMENDS OR BANS THE SHOTS FOR YOUNG PEOPLE.
So, what pattern do you see forming here? Is this an American "Conservative / Liberal" problem?
No. It's a problem with US and Canadian politics. The political systems here are SO CORRUPT, the Politicians are so morally repugnant that the truth never gets out. All they care about is making money.
You want to experiment on yourself with self mutilation as an adult, go for it. But stay away from our children. Period.
This article is, first of all, an astonishing example of just how badly the ACLU has lost its way. Here’s one example among many:
“The bills that were just signed by Ron DeSantis in Florida are pretty instructive here. He's signed a bill outlawing trans people from using the restroom, most consistent with their gender identity, threatening them with criminal penalty if they're caught using the wrong restroom.”
I am perfectly willing to admit that this is a complex situation with many competing interests. But the ACLU apparently believes that it’s a more or less straightforward issue of right vs wrong. The ACLU apparently believes that by allowing men/trans women into a space reserved for biological women (a women’s restroom) they are doing nothing more than expanding the rights of a persecuted minority. But it can just as easily be argued that the ACLU is, in this and other cases, trying to deny and erase the hard-won rights and private spaces of biological women.
If and when the ACLU wants to counter that “trans women are women,” they are no longer arguing for civil rights. In that case, they are promoting an extreme gender ideology that actively persecutes anyone who dares to dissent (JK Rowling states that she could wallpaper her house with the number of death threats she has received from extremist gender ideologues).
Just think about that absolutely head-spinning turn of affairs: the ACLU now appears to be aiding and abetting an extremist sect that actively fights AGAINST free speech. In all of our fictional dystopias, I don’t think anyone ever imagined a once noble organization losing its way in such a tragic, profound, and utterly counterproductive manner.
But it gets worse. These days, it always gets worse. The type of approach in the above quote involves the kind of gaslighting and the kind of reductive thought processes that typically define populist movements. And yet here, that sort of Leftist populism is promoted in a supposedly “un-populist” publication. I think even Orwell would sit back in stunned silence.
Most heteronormatives just want to associate with other heteronormatives. Standing up for the freedom to associate used to be a central attraction drawing people to the UCLA. Now that it refuses to stand up for free speech, is this another civil liberty they are discarding? Will they change their name to "standing up for whatever is kewl?"
I'm a gay male. I've fought all my adult life to advance a recognition that there's nothing "queer" about same-sex attraction. I’m attracted to guys; I’ve never hidden that fact, and (as my parents raised me) I’m proud simply to be myself. I never signed up to "smash cisheteropatriarchy" in the name of some Brave New World.
It's said that sexual orientation is about who you go to bed with, while "gender identity" is WHAT you go to bed AS. Consider how insulting (and homophobic) it is to ask a gay male, "Are you the ’man’ or the ‘woman’ in bed?" That’s an affront to the very definition of same-sex attraction!
We repudiate "gender identity"; "Trans" people repudiate biological sex.
A person genuinely suffering from a brain-body mismatch (due to a neurological or hormonal anomaly) deserves the same decency, compassion and access to medical treatment (if need be) as anyone with a deformity or disability. That’s a far cry from “LGBTQIA+,” let alone “queer.”
"A loser's game"? Both sides in this so-called "culture war" are running a protection racket (jeopardizing all the acceptance that gay people have gained). Thanks, but no thanks!
I don't think the US removes 500k children from homes each year (but am open to being wrong about that) - maybe that's the total number of children in foster care?
Also, re: the state removing children from homes, I hope both participants in the conversation agree that is wrong whether it's for giving kids blockers/hormones (like in Texas) or for not giving kids blockers/hormones (like in Oregon and California).
This seems like an issue that would really benefit from lowering the temperature of conversation and not acting like the most marginal cases (both parents who want very young kids to transition and angry fundamentalists who disown their kids) are representative of the majority of trans people and their families.
Also, there is a disanalogy in the comparison in that Ukraine's population is a tenth of the United States' and Putin removed kids from there within a span of a few months. I agree with you about lowering the temperature.
I do not think that the guest from the ACLU helped by comparing the current moment in the US to Jim Crow, Nazi Germany, Putin's Russia, etc. One might even say she is trying to turn up the heat.
Oh I forgot, also, chattel slavery and indigenous boarding schools. Let's throw the Inquisition and some other stuff in there too 😂
This article throws out all sorts of straw men and logical fallacies.
Trans people are not being demonized for being trans. TRANS PEOPLE ARE BEING DEMONIZED FOR RECRUITING LITTLE CHILDREN before sexuality should even be a discussion for children.
Additionally, the LGBT community make up a relatively small portion of society and the trans community make up a much smaller portion of society. Why are their rights being pushed to the forefront of the discussion while other much larger communities are being maligned?
This sort of partisan, short sighted, divisive journalism does more harm than good and literally greats a reason for the "right wing populism" you are opposing to grow.
Your comment clarified something for me. Namely, one of the key features of contemporary American right-wing thought is a perspective that says mere acknowledgment and recognition of ideas and identities social conservatives don't like is indoctrination (and so morally blameworthy), while actual indoctrination into ideas and identities they do like is instead mere acknowledgement and recognition (and so morally acceptable—and often morally praiseworthy and necessary).
What you describe is the MO of the Left just as much as it is of the Right. Both sides are open to bias, but the real root concern here is that the Left is OK to make mistakes and sweep them under the rug in regards to how children are treated.
For example, with the transgender movement they are OK to experiment on children even if it's damaging to MANY of them in the future. While the Rest of the World is waking up and stopping sex change operations on children, in North America they continue to push them harder than ever.
They used the same rationale with Covid-19 shots in the West. Unproven, experimental drug but they are being mandated / pushed into children...EVEN AS THE REST OF THE WORLD EITHER DE-RECOMMENDS OR BANS THE SHOTS FOR YOUNG PEOPLE.
So, what pattern do you see forming here? Is this an American "Conservative / Liberal" problem?
No. It's a problem with US and Canadian politics. The political systems here are SO CORRUPT, the Politicians are so morally repugnant that the truth never gets out. All they care about is making money.
You want to experiment on yourself with self mutilation as an adult, go for it. But stay away from our children. Period.
That is the only root concern in this debate.
This article is, first of all, an astonishing example of just how badly the ACLU has lost its way. Here’s one example among many:
“The bills that were just signed by Ron DeSantis in Florida are pretty instructive here. He's signed a bill outlawing trans people from using the restroom, most consistent with their gender identity, threatening them with criminal penalty if they're caught using the wrong restroom.”
I am perfectly willing to admit that this is a complex situation with many competing interests. But the ACLU apparently believes that it’s a more or less straightforward issue of right vs wrong. The ACLU apparently believes that by allowing men/trans women into a space reserved for biological women (a women’s restroom) they are doing nothing more than expanding the rights of a persecuted minority. But it can just as easily be argued that the ACLU is, in this and other cases, trying to deny and erase the hard-won rights and private spaces of biological women.
If and when the ACLU wants to counter that “trans women are women,” they are no longer arguing for civil rights. In that case, they are promoting an extreme gender ideology that actively persecutes anyone who dares to dissent (JK Rowling states that she could wallpaper her house with the number of death threats she has received from extremist gender ideologues).
Just think about that absolutely head-spinning turn of affairs: the ACLU now appears to be aiding and abetting an extremist sect that actively fights AGAINST free speech. In all of our fictional dystopias, I don’t think anyone ever imagined a once noble organization losing its way in such a tragic, profound, and utterly counterproductive manner.
But it gets worse. These days, it always gets worse. The type of approach in the above quote involves the kind of gaslighting and the kind of reductive thought processes that typically define populist movements. And yet here, that sort of Leftist populism is promoted in a supposedly “un-populist” publication. I think even Orwell would sit back in stunned silence.
Most heteronormatives just want to associate with other heteronormatives. Standing up for the freedom to associate used to be a central attraction drawing people to the UCLA. Now that it refuses to stand up for free speech, is this another civil liberty they are discarding? Will they change their name to "standing up for whatever is kewl?"
They're not asking for "equal dignity", they're asking for Uber rights and forced celebration of their lifestyles.
Typical communist method of changing the meaning of words just to confuse people.
Some things never change. ARP is not a libertarian.
I'm a gay male. I've fought all my adult life to advance a recognition that there's nothing "queer" about same-sex attraction. I’m attracted to guys; I’ve never hidden that fact, and (as my parents raised me) I’m proud simply to be myself. I never signed up to "smash cisheteropatriarchy" in the name of some Brave New World.
It's said that sexual orientation is about who you go to bed with, while "gender identity" is WHAT you go to bed AS. Consider how insulting (and homophobic) it is to ask a gay male, "Are you the ’man’ or the ‘woman’ in bed?" That’s an affront to the very definition of same-sex attraction!
We repudiate "gender identity"; "Trans" people repudiate biological sex.
A person genuinely suffering from a brain-body mismatch (due to a neurological or hormonal anomaly) deserves the same decency, compassion and access to medical treatment (if need be) as anyone with a deformity or disability. That’s a far cry from “LGBTQIA+,” let alone “queer.”
"A loser's game"? Both sides in this so-called "culture war" are running a protection racket (jeopardizing all the acceptance that gay people have gained). Thanks, but no thanks!